PTOTW #13 Week 24 - May 2008

[Boilermaker]

Gamer, i feel your pain brother....I play low stakes and you have alot of that there...you'll have the best hand till the river you know how hard it is to push people out of the pot at low stakes...
I have went for months trying to keep my bankroll above ground, tryin to survive bad beat after bad beat. Then it'll goto months of good cash steaks and really start showing a growing bankroll.
I do ok at low stakes but the bad beat are a dime a dozen. I try not to get upset because this gets you way of your game.
When i use to get knocked out of a tournament to a bad beat, It was too easy to jump into another 9man s&g , thinking I was on my Game just got sucked out on, but still steaming over pryor game and not being clear headed to play my best.
Called controlled thinking, if you can't control your feelings...then it's hard to say you can control your thinking.

anywayz, I hope you know we are your friends here, but there's no friends at the table.

Best of luck

[frob23]

Originally Posted by gamer4life27 Yeah, so for this past month of two, making all the right plays, having the best hands most of the time and losing, thats just poker, right? Of fckin course it is! It's just fckin poker! No sence in making a big deal about losing pocket aces against ATC more than 75% of the time online, huh!? Fck no, it's just fckin poker!!

Yes, this is exactly what it is. Skill is a long term thing and luck rules the short term. You will have those times where you constantly make the right play and lose. It can happen over and over and over... you can drop 10-15 buy-ins without seeing a win but playing perfectly. This is the game. It stinks at times but it's the way it is.

[liladypokerpro]

So how did it go guys??? I see gamer is the cussbox again (sorry gamer) look on the bright side at least I didn't do it this time

[gamer4life27]

I'm just sick of people not respecting me anywhere. I can't get any at the poker table, none online, and it's starting to really get to me. How would you feel if EVERYONE called your raises no matter what they had? Not even in any blind or anything only to suckout. I just can't take how rude people are to me at the poker table against my plays.

[frob23]

Originally Posted by gamer4life27 I'm just sick of people not respecting me anywhere. I can't get any at the poker table, none online, and it's starting to really get to me. How would you feel if EVERYONE called your raises no matter what they had? Not even in any blind or anything only to suckout. I just can't take how rude people are to me at the poker table against my plays.

You can't take that personally. And, I have some people I play with who will call with literally any two cards when I am in the hand. My step-brother in particular is always looking to get in a hand with me. He will call with anything and play it hard after the flop (hit or not) because he knows that I know he could be playing anything and could have hit. It can be very frustrating but also very profitable at the same time.

If you want respect on the poker table, consistently show down solid hands. And you'll get respect from the observant players. But, in truth, most low limit players online aren't observant and won't care what you have shown down in the past. They are going to play their cards without even giving much thought to what your cards are. This is an ideal situation and, in the long run, it's where your profit comes from. When people consistently call with the worst hands and without the odds to improve... you are making a profit.

You are going to be sucked out on... you will have it happen over and over and over and every single day. And, it has nothing to do with you. Let it go and move on. They're not being rude to you... they're being rude to their own bankroll. They are showing disrespect to that and nothing else.

I don't know why I bother responding to posts like this. If you want to have a pity-party... don't send me an invite.

[liladypokerpro]

Originally Posted by gamer4life27 I'm just sick of people not respecting me anywhere. I can't get any at the poker table, none online, and it's starting to really get to me. How would you feel if EVERYONE called your raises no matter what they had? Not even in any blind or anything only to suckout. I just can't take how rude people are to me at the poker table against my plays.

A huge part of the game is self-discipline...you've got to be able to take the bad with the good or the bad will haunt you to the point where you will go on perma-tilt and never be successful.

Not being funny, being totally serious here: Get some incense and burn it...preferably Lavender for calming and focus. Clear your mind and focus on keeping yourself calm and centered. Once you master control of your emotions, take that skill to the poker tables with you...you'll be a beast for sure as long as you can clear your mind after losing, and control your reactions.

It's so funny because this ties into something I was talking with Carrie about earlier. We were watching the Olympic qualifiers for the diving competition, and the commentators kept saying how the Chinese competitors are always so perfect and focused as compared with Americans in whom you can clearly see their nerves taking a toll on them.

The reason why Chinese and Japanese (or relatively any Asian) people are so calm and focused is because they regularly practice meditation and discipline rituals...it's also why their scholastic scores far surpass that of Americans.

Self control and discipline are keys to success in any aspect of life...most especially in sports...

[frob23]

lol... I love having some incense burning here. And I do practice daily meditation... maybe that is why I am so mellow.


As an aside, I should be the one complaining about not having any respect. Earlier today, in a tournament, I opened for 5xBB from UTG... and got SIX callers! Apparently most of the table had no respect for me. As an aside, I hit my set of Jacks on the flop... and went broke when the person in the CO (who had limped with QQ) also hit their set.

{frob does his best Rodney Dangerfield, "I get no respect. The way my luck is running, if I was a politician I would be honest."}

[gamer4life27]

But trust me, when playing live, I get viewed TOTALLY different than other players. Even worse that some stuck-up people treat girls at the poker table it's that bad. I play with my poker crew who all say I am a very excelent player. Very skilled, but at the poker table, every time I raise, like half the table always calls me and always shows me crap. I never do that to them and it pisses me off. I know theres nothing I can do about it, but I guess thats what gets to me. But how can I get people to respect me with no bankroll though?

[liladypokerpro]

Originally Posted by gamer4life27 But trust me, when playing live, I get viewed TOTALLY different than other players. Even worse that some stuck-up people treat girls at the poker table it's that bad. I play with my poker crew who all say I am a very excellent player. Very skilled, but at the poker table, every time I raise, like half the table always calls me and always shows me crap. I never do that to them and it pisses me off. I know theres nothing I can do about it, but I guess thats what gets to me. But how can I get people to respect me with no bankroll though?

Perhaps your "excellence" is your downfall...let me explain:

Many people who are extremely tight, eg playing only premium hands, can become quite predictable...perhaps this is why you get taken advantage of often by lesser hands...if they feel that you are extremely tight then you probably expect them to be the same, and this is what they will base their play against you on.....they know that if they play any two cards against you and win it will throw you into a fit (so-to-speak).

So, basically they are playing "ace cracker hands" against you any time you raise, because they feel they've got you pegged to a tee. So, try switching up a bit...play a little more loosely (not crazy maniac loose, but you get the idea), and instead of trying to beat them, make them try to beat you...play with their minds, and stop letting them play with yours.

[frob23]

Originally Posted by gamer4life27 But trust me, when playing live, I get viewed TOTALLY different than other players. Even worse that some stuck-up people treat girls at the poker table it's that bad. I play with my poker crew who all say I am a very excelent player. Very skilled, but at the poker table, every time I raise, like half the table always calls me and always shows me crap. I never do that to them and it pisses me off. I know theres nothing I can do about it, but I guess thats what gets to me. But how can I get people to respect me with no bankroll though?

My sister loves it when people underestimate her at the poker table. Best of all, she loves it when people play her in Hold'em (not her game) and then Stud and assume the same level of ability in Stud (which is her game). But she puts up with it a lot. Eventually, they learn or they keep donating. She's absolutely relentless in Stud... especially short-handed... and she'll just eat you away if you don't give her credit for knowing what she's doing.

Now, without knowing the ability level of your crew... I can't say much about their judgment. I know several people who think I am almost a professional player but I know very different. It is just that they are comparing the level of thought and ability they put into the game with mine and seeing more on my side but don't really have a way to compare it against a true pro. I've even had offers (serious offers) for staking from some players who ran extended stats on me (unknown to me at the time) and had to turn them down because I know the difference between my ability and what they believe my ability to be.

Without seeing you play live, it's hard to say why you have a problem -- if you really have a problem at all and it's not just in your head. How you dress, how you act, your language, age, look, and play all will effect the respect level people give you at the table. My advice for an instant 20% boost in respect:

* lose the sunglasses if you're wearing them (this isn't $50/$100NL you're playing)
* lose the t-shirt and online poker room logo hats/bags/etc
* lose the scruff (shave completely or keep facial hair neat and trimmed, same with head hair)
* wear light but comfortable dress pants/shorts (no jeans and no cargo pants** there are exceptions here)
* wear a solid colored button up shirt (short sleeved is fine).
* wear comfortable shoes but not sneakers** another exception applies here
* talk less at the table than you do now... at least 50% of your talk should be non-game related (work talk is good)
* fold... fold a lot... make a game out of it... and then fold some more. You're only playing strong hands... do not draw attention to this... people will notice
* do not tilt, do not make a big deal when you fold (don't say anything actually... just fold), and do not comment on other people's cards

When I go play, I usually keep the shirt from work on, throw on some light dress shorts or cargo shorts, and some sandals. With my overall "formal" look... the shorts and sandals seem to make it look like I am TRYING to be casual but I'm not. Most of all... from the surface of the table on up, I look serious. I am there to play some cards and I am dressed and look conservative... plus I fold a lot which leads people to believe my play is conservative as well.

This will have an immediate effect (if it's not your normal crowd -- and a delayed effect even with them) and also an extended effect. In some of my live games, I get some people who make amazing lay-downs (at least that is what they think) because, "I know you don't bet with garbage," as they would [and do] say. It's just image and history.

[gamer4life27]

But thats the thing. I bet with both garbage and premium hands, I can act with the rest of the good poker players, and I don't dress up, but I don't dress down for poker either. I tend to change up my game quite a bit, and every single one of my poker buddies know this. They know that I know how to lay down a hand when I'm bluffing, and they know I have some pretty good reads on them as well. But I really think it's my age. I'm really young, and people know this. They say I'm a really good poker player, but at the table, they don't think of me that way. They think of my as the kid at the table, when I truley am not. I have made the final table every single time I have played at our home games. The only time I don't is when I get cracked on a bad beat.

I just don't get it. People say I am a really good poker player everywhere i go, but my looks (facial and age) tell them otherwise. I look like a regular poker player which confuses me more. I don't wear sunglasses, I don't wear hats, I don't sponser any poker sites, I don't do anything out of the norm, yet they treat me like some kid who doesn't know what there doing constantly.

[liladypokerpro]

Hmm.....well, in that case, the only other thing I can think of is whatever you do that people take advantage of, try doing the opposite...then when you start cracking them, they will be forced to start playing tighter or go broke.

Once you notice their pattern changing, you can then revert back to your original style, and continue taking advantage of the table, utterly confusing them to no end...every time they change, you change. Keep them guessing...in essence, play chess with them, mentally. Force them to be trapped pawns to your limitless queen. If you let them get in your head like this, then they will always treat you the same way, so take control.

Only you can make them change their attitude toward you...by beating them...consistently...and the only way you're going to do that is by taking control, focusing on the table and their play, and not worrying about what they think of you.

PS > Once you establish control, your age will be the LAST thing on their minds, I can promise you that

[frob23]

The clothing issue will mitigate the age factor. Dressed like I suggest you will look like a young professional who is out after work to relax. I have some serious baby-face when I shave (I get carded going to R-rated movies... despite having been of age for over a decade) and still don't get treated like a kid at the table. I present myself as a professional (not poker professional... work professional) who just looks young. I have a semi-serious demeanor and look very conservative. And people treat me like that image.

Trust me, your clothing reveals more about your age than you may think.

If you're really getting called too often then you're probably mixing your game up too much and do not have a reputation as a solid player. You shouldn't be anywhere near 1:1 on bad hands to good hands. I'd say 1:4 maybe... 2:5 at the most -- IF (and this is a big if) you want people to respect your bets. If you want people to doubt that you always have a hand... play more but be comfortable that they're going to call light.

[liladypokerpro]

I've got a severe case of baby face....and the fact that I'm only 5'3 and 125 pounds just adds salt to the wound.

A few good examples: at age 27 (current), I have been carded to buy a rated R dvd at Walmart, as well as to buy BBs for a BB gun I purchased as a birthday gift for a friend of mine's son...when I asked how old you have to be to purchase BBs, the salesman said "15" and I laughed so hard when he saw my License When walking home from work one night around 2am a few years ago, a police officer stopped me and asked where my parents were (lol) and when I said "Alabama" he had this look on his face you couldn't possibly put a price on...and again, when he saw my License I laughed at his flabbergasted expression

To get around this problem, I completely agree with Frob.......the clothes can make the man (or woman in my case). Depending upon how well you can make yourself up, you can present an image that will make everyone curious...and thus, more cautious. The key to keeping it successful is to make your table image mirror the physical image you want to portray.