Full Tilt Cheating???

[pondragon]

Originally Posted by catch016 You know what I think it is? Usually, you make a withdrawal after winning, right? So after this winning streak and withdrawal, it's just variance catching up to you and you lose. You never make a withdrawal after losing. It's always after winning. I've made a lot of withdrawals and sometimes I lose the next day, sometimes it's a 3 or 4 days later. No matter what though, that loss always comes. Nobody wins every day. That's just my opinion.

I definitely think this is the reason people are superstitious. Because we are withdrawing after big wins, we inevitably go on losses if not big losses afterwards, due to variance. It is our job to minimize our losses and maximize our gains.

The poker room has no interest in how well you do, only that you keep playing. They don't care that you're taking money out of circulation on the tables because that means you've won, others have lost and THEY are the ones replenishing what you take out. There is always somebody losing because there is always someone winning. In other words there is always someone buying back in and someone cashing out.

[elfanor]

I guess it has to be bad luck but that has happened to me. I first started playing online about 2 years ago on Everest poker (very popular in eastern Europe). I actually started playing there because they have playmoney 10 seat limit tourneys where the winner walks away with $0.05.

I didnt want to make a deposit so I figured Id practice that way.

Anyway, after a couple weeks I was able to get a bankroll of about $10 and start playing very low NL cash games, like 0.05-0.1. There are so many fishes at that stake that I was able to get up to $400 after about a month.

I figured, "heh, might aswell withdraw some of that since Im not gonna start playing higher stakes untill I get better". I withdrew $200 and kept a $200 bankroll witch is decent for $5 buy-ins.

From that point I got bad beats over bad beats (you gotta expect some with donkeys but not all the time) and I was down to nothing within a week (playing the exact same way).

At that point it was obvious I got unlucky, but heh, that's poker. So I deposit $50, get back up to $400 in about a month, withdraw $200 and booh Im down to nothing once again.



I still made some profit so I dont really care but I decided to switch sites and now Im on Fullt Tilt. And the same story happens again...I deposit, unlock the bonus, get up to $400 and withdraw half of that (I had a $50 deposit + $50 bonus). Then, in no time Im down to nothing (got some FTP meanwhile so I was able to buy in into numerous sattelite and get some cash out of it).

Whats striking here is that the way I play doesnt change an inch, but every time I withdraw I loose what I got left...




The way I see it,and since it doesnt only happens to me, its either :

A : Bad luck and running into your variance or whatever (hmm, maybe).

B : Those site are really corrupted and try to get you to deposit again (since they make their money out of the rack I dont think thats the case).

C : People character tends to change once they've withdrawn.
I mean, when I withdraw some cash, Im like : "poker is easy, Im making some cash spending only a few hours a week, damn Im good..." and at that point people might tend to relax and loose some of their focus, and thats what I really think happens. It doesnt affect pro or semi pros since they withdraw every 2 days, but for the more casual players like myself, getting some cash might affect you emotionnaly and worse, you might not notice it right away.



Sorry for the misstyping and everything, english is not my langage and I didnt take the time to read myself...

[dew12109]

I think your third analysis is probably the most accurate. In fact, I fully believe your third analysis, and I disagree with B fully, and I think A has at most 10% to do with it.

[hpplaya]

I can't imagine why any poker site would penalize players for withdrawing funds. It just seems to me that they are ther to make money and provide a service (online poker). Doesn't seem to make much sense to cheat customers. If suspected I was being cheated I wouldn't play on that site. Let's take a look at the example of Absolute and Ultimate Bet poker sites. Different scenario... But after the cheating that was going on there.. I closed my accounts... I would never trust them and it makes me leary of other sites.. So far.. I have only suffered bad beats by horrible players... But hey they are good for the game.. I make more money of them than I lose...LOL

[powrdragn]

It's not all coincidence.

People play looser and sloppier when they are winning and are up big. They've cashed out, made some money, and are living freely. They forget the fundamentals that got them there.

They start to focus on the beats and whatnot, all the while forgetting what got them that check in the mail.

[Meryville]

i really get badbeats everday there with aa qq kki think thoes ar the badesst hands to get there!!

[Boeggs]

Honestly, I don't trust any of them. I firmly believe they control who wins and who doesn't.

[I Eat Gamblers]

elfanor..........
I have to go with C. i truely believe that is the answer, i've been there before, head swells a bit and you don't realize the slight change in your play until the hand is over. At this point you think why did i call, why did i play that much to see the next card normally i would fold. Then anger may take over a bit and here comes a tilt moment ETC...

Anyway i believe C. is the true answer, not that FTP or any other site is cheating. Everyone thinks that the sites are cheating cuz of AP, and that happened over a yr ago.

[elfanor]

I always thought Full tilt was bad for bad beats but I got worse the other day.

I was on Titan and I got Aces 5 times vs Queens in one night, 4 out of 5 all in pre flop and Ive lost all 5 of them (all of them bad beats).

Thats roughly 80%-20%, so 5 times in a row thats like 1/300.000 that it happens. Or winning the national lottery twice in a row.

[allthatremains]

Originally Posted by elfanor I always thought Full tilt was bad for bad beats but I got worse the other day. I was on Titan and I got Aces 5 times vs Queens in one night, 4 out of 5 all in pre flop and Ive lost all 5 of them (all of them bad beats). Thats roughly 80%-20%, so 5 times in a row thats like 1/300.000 that it happens. Or winning the national lottery twice in a row.

Well, you are right that the queens should only win about 1 out of every 5 times against aces(depending on the suits of each).

So let's see the odds of it happening 5 times in a row.

5x5x5x5x5=3125 - So the odds of this happening were about 1 in 3125.

I'm not sure where you live, but the odds of me winning our national lottery are 1 in 14 million. The odds of me winning it twice in a row are : 14million x 14 million = ?

Let's hope your aces don't keep getting cracked until it reaches these odds.

[irishpkr]

Originally Posted by allthatremains Well, you are right that the queens should only win about 1 out of every 5 times against aces(depending on the suits of each). So let's see the odds of it happening 5 times in a row. 5x5x5x5x5=3125 - So the odds of this happening were about 1 in 3125. I'm not sure where you live, but the odds of me winning our national lottery are 1 in 14 million. The odds of me winning it twice in a row are : 14million x 14 million = ? Let's hope your aces don't keep getting cracked until it reaches these odds.

You just have to go and spoil all the fun?! This is a cheating/bad beat thread, bullshit stories are par for the course -_-

[dew12109]

Well, I'm not sure what national lottery you have, but for me the powerball odds of winning the jackpot are 1 in 146,107,962. So the odds of winning this twice would be 1 in 21,347,536,559,793,444. However just the general odds of winning any prize would be 1 in 36.61, so of "winning" twice it would be 1 in 1340.2921. So the odds of losing with AA vs QQ 5 times in a row is actually lower than the odds of winning ANY prize two times in a row with my semi-national lottery. So, depending on what elf meant, while his figures are off, he could be underestimating or overestimating. I do have a feeling that his claim was meant that he experienced the same odds as 1 in 21,347,536,559,793,444 though.

[johndoe23]

I think it is a combination of variance and arrogance. I see the same pattern in my game but not from withdraws. Every time I have a big win, I deviate from my play that got me there and start losing because I am too aggressive or playing too loss thinking I can beat this game with any 2 cards.

[EliminateU]

at a truer 81% to 19% I come up with it happening 5 consecutive times without interruption as approximately 1 in 4038. It is something i'd bet my whole bankroll on not happening, especially 1 to 1 money. you are due for a good run.

[Krahsami]

When I first started I was suspicious the way I would encounter bad hands and lose roughly what I gained in a rake payment for a while there. They reward donk plays there a lot is what I notice. Not the type of site I enjoy.

I just started playing again there this month for one reason only. Year end iron man bonus. I know why I left now in the first place. Never been 2 and 3 outted heads up all in preflop in my life. 3 or 4 ppl calling and getting out drawn, sure but heads up and the amount of times it happened this month is just making me wonder if I pissed a programmer off there or something. I was scared when I got AA or KK. PRETTY FRIGGING SAD. Anyway I know one of my new years resolution and that's that FT can kiss my A$$ next year because I won't have to worry about any iron man Junk and there stupid rake back player added CRAP. In fact 300 more FT points and I don't have to worry about waiting until new years. I can spend the FT points now too since they won't crush my rake back for it.

IT'S CALLED FULL TILT FOR A REASON.

[irishpkr]

Originally Posted by Krahsami They reward donk plays there a lot is what I notice. Not the type of site I enjoy.

You should enjoy this site, DUCY?

[brokeyoazz2708]

I have lost w/ KK 3 times today once flop was 9jj i pushed called by q9 and went QQ on turn and river. Lost with Aces once against 9 j suited and lost with queens twice. tell me the odds of all that in one day???

[tstrachan22]

I just started playing again there this month for one reason only. Year end iron man bonus. I know why I left now in the first place. Never been 2 and 3 outted heads up all in preflop in my life. 3 or 4 ppl calling and getting out drawn, sure but heads up and the amount of times it happened this month is just making me wonder if I pissed a programmer off there or something. I was scared when I got AA or KK. PRETTY FRIGGING SAD. Anyway I know one of my new years resolution and that's that FT can kiss my A$$ next year because I won't have to worry about any iron man Junk and there stupid rake back player added CRAP. In fact 300 more FT points and I don't have to worry about waiting until new years. I can spend the FT points now too since they won't crush my rake back for it.

Did I miss something? When did spending ft points NOT take away from rakeback and why will 300 more help you accomplish that? Please let me know because I have like 25k ftp and havnt spent 1 yet because of the rakeback hit I would take. Anyone know what Krahsami means?

[jgmotorfan]

have known for a long time that all these sites base their seating patterns off deposit ,withdraw programs on the same computer program that runs the cards.

[irishpkr]

Originally Posted by jgmotorfan have known for a long time that all these sites base their seating patterns off deposit ,withdraw programs on the same computer program that runs the cards.

I've known for the 10seconds since I read this that you're a dumbass :P