I like being a micro player and don't plan on moving up

[frob23]

This is something I have come to terms with. I enjoy playing the micro limits. I know the play is terrible and variance often is huge at those tables. But I like it. I enjoy playing for pennies and not worrying about the money.

Over the past year or so, I have increased my bankroll significantly from where I started. When I started, playing $10NL and lower was required because that was what my bankroll on the various sites dictated. But these days it's almost funny when I sit down and buy-in for less than 1% of my online bankroll for that site.

My friends who know me keep asking when I am going to move up. When am I going to start consistently playing $25NL and $50NL so I can make more money and keep moving up. I am bankrolled for those games, they point out, even according to my fairly strict bankroll management rules. But I have no desire. I like the levels I play and I get pleasure when I play them. It doesn't matter to me that I won't be making a ton of money off poker. I have increasingly become aware that I don't play for the money. I play because I enjoy the game and the challenge.

I realized this today as I was playing some $25NL on PokerStars (to try and get some VPP like I need). I was doing ok and I was enjoying it but not anymore than I would if I had been playing lower. I didn't need $25 on the table and $12 pots to have a good time. I have a good time with $5 on the table and $2 pots.

Will I ever move up? Maybe. Anything is possible but I don't plan on it. I'm a recreational player and I don't feel the need to play higher right now. Just my little rant.

Part of this rant comes after talking to my step-brother and trying to explain to him that I don't want to play $50NL or $100NL even if it will get me a lot of VPP and even if I am technically bankrolled for it (at least for $50NL). I just want to play in my little sandbox and be left alone.

[Legion III]

I appreciate what you’re saying Frob. But for me at least, I don’t feel the same thrill unless I am pushing the envelope of my BR. If and when I am able to move up to the next level of play I am going to do so.

[SirSmokes]

I like play for lower limits because I'm good at big fields and i can play a lot of those at smaller limits but at the same time. making the final table at a 4 dollar buy in and 25 dollar final table is a little bit different feeling in my opinion. when my bankroll is small i play a lot of low limits. but every now and then i throw in a bigger buy in that is usually a guaranteed

[bossmanisme]

nothing wrong with that. if you don't need the money and enjoy smaller stakes more, then what's the point in moving up?
one thing i will say though in argument for moving up is that it can get to be a bit of the same thing over and over and become a little boring. moving up and playing against better players can help in that you'll start to have more of the mental battle. more of a challenge, more thinking, something to improve on. i personally like a challenge so i enjoy it. but to each his own.

[frob23]

Yeah but I haven't seen much difference in the level of play at $25NL when compared to $10NL. There's a very tiny improvement in the general play but since I'm looking for the weak and loose tables anyway, it's not too much. Maybe at $50NL and higher the play improves a lot, but who knows. And right now I am happy where I am at.

[Wallace]

Your attitude is good, certainly not one that is going to send you busto!

Might I suggest firing up more tables of $10NL? This can present a challenge in itself.

Also you may find it's better to grind a site with rakeback at micro stakes as the VPP system at stars is awful for micro players (although I think they are brining in partial VPP points for micros in feb/march).

[frob23]

I generally play at PokerNordica (where I have rakeback). But I am trying to get money off of PokerStars right now and they won't let me cashout without earning 15 VPP per $100 I want to take off. I am not taking all my money off... just $300. I want to leave some on for the sit and gos and tournaments (which don't give rakeback on Nordica and I like more on Stars).

Of course, with the way Stars is treating me as a micro-player right now... I am half tempted to just take it all off.

[Wallace]

I generally play at PokerNordica (where I have rakeback). But I am trying to get money off of PokerStars right now and they won't let me cashout without earning 15 VPP per $100 I want to take off. I am not taking all my money off... just $300. I want to leave some on for the sit and gos and tournaments (which don't give rakeback on Nordica and I like more on Stars).

Of course, with the way Stars is treating me as a micro-player right now... I am half tempted to just take it all off.

Double or nothing tournies are a good way to earn some VPP and if you have half a clue on how to adjust the strategy (just think to yourself when we get down to 5 if I have 7000 chips or 100 chips it makes no difference) you should easily breakeven.

Since you spend most of your time folding in these tournies its a good way to learn how to multitable also.

[XDRAGON]

I think it's good that you enjoy playing at the micro stakes and its totally your choice. However you say you enjoy the challenge, thats the part i dont understand. I have multi-tabled low stakes games in the past and although it was profitable, it was so boring. As any good player knows, all you need to do to beat the micro stakes is sit back and play abc poker. To me the real challenge and fun in poker comes from the deep thinking mind battles, trying to outsmart your opponents which you only get at the higher limits. Im not saying that trying to out play other good players is the best way to make money from poker because it isn't but i do think its the most fun and challenging.

[big_rob187]

it sucks more than anyone will ever know when you just can't fucking win anything

[XDRAGON]

then your clearly a donk

[frob23]

This is a good hand to illustrate why I am not in a rush to move up to $25NL for the challenge. This sort of play isn't atypical at this level. So if I enjoy playing $10NL just as much, it's not like I am moving up for the mental challenge that $25NL will provide.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (7 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.

saw flop | saw showdown

Hero (SB) ($29.40)
BB ($24.45)
UTG ($28.10)
MP1 ($11.05)
MP2 ($34.55)
CO ($32.65)
Button ($11.25)



Preflop: Hero is SB with ,
1 fold, MP1 calls $0.25, 2 folds, Button calls $0.25, Hero calls $0.15, BB checks

I am not a fan of K-Jo out of position but for the price, I don't mind taking a flop against three likely players. The BB was unaggressive so the chance of being raised was very low and something I could easily fold to.

Flop: ($1) , , (4 players)
Hero bets $1, 1 fold, MP1 calls $1, 1 fold

Ok, I flop top pair and second best kicker. The flop is not horribly threatening. I fire out a PSB (Pot Sized Bet) to hopefully just pick this pot up and move on with my life. I am not completely threatened by the call from MP1. I suspect a small to medium pair here and maybe AJ. There's also QJs, JTs, and other funky Js that he could be holding and might have limped. As I beat most of these, I don't worry too much about them. I find the idea of them having a 3 to be unlikely. Of course, anything is possible but it's not something I consider strongly.

Turn: ($3) (2 players)
Hero bets $2.25, MP1 raises to $4.50

This is a good turn card. It really only improves a pair of 5s in the range I have pretty much placed the player on. I fire out a 3/4th PSB and get insta-min-raised. I am not thrilled about this. And 4.3-1 pot odds aren't really great. I consider the chance that they would do this with a hand I beat and find it unlikely. Still, I decide to make the call, especially since the player only has $5.30 left and if I hit a K and am still behind, I don't mind paying off that little.

This is probably a bad call virtually 100% of the time. I don't know that this is ever a min-raise bluff. At the time, I also considered it possible he was doing this with a worse Jack but in retrospect, I don't see that happening.

River: ($7.50) (2 players)
Hero bets $5.60, MP1 calls $5.30 (All-In)

Probably the best card I could hit. I am behind only to quads now. Any worse Jack (part of the range I still suspect) will call any bet, of course, and I'll lose a little to the rake. I think I might get an over-pair to the board to call once in a while but not too often. I expect split this pot just about every time but I bet anyway. I am not going to fold to a shove so I might as well be making the bet.

Total pot: $18.10 | Rake: $1.10
Main pot: $18.10 between Hero and MP1, won by Hero

Results:
Hero had J, K (full house, Jacks over threes).
MP1 mucked 3, 2 (full house, threes over Jacks).
Outcome: Hero won $21.50

HOLY CRAP!?!?! Go back and look at that river call. This is obviously a spot where he's just been massively drawn out on, just about every single time. But he calls anyway. Granted, he deserved it for open-limping 2-3s but still. What does he expect me to have here that he beats? Yes, I know he's getting 3-1 on the call here but how often are those odds enough? And that is half the stack he started the hand with. OUCH.

I do love the micro-stakes. But I don't need to play $25NL to find play this bad... I can find it at $10NL too... and I don't mind either.

[EliminateU]

Of course on his side he thinks your turn call on his raise was donkish to hit your 9%-91% card.

[frob23]

Of course on his side he thinks your turn call on his raise was donkish to hit your 9%-91% card.

Absolutely and I admit the call was bad and questionable given the spot. But the call on the end is suicidal. What does he put me on that he beats now? There's not much except a pure bluff.

[braveboat27]

I agree; unless I'm in the blinds, or late position, KJ is hitting the muck.

[big_rob187]

some of us don't have the choice were just cursed with shity luck

[bossmanisme]

there may not be much of a challenge increase at 25NL, but at .50-1 and up there does start to be more of a challenge. but obviously you would (probably) need to gradually move up. so if you started to now, then you'd be there later if you wanted to be. not saying you should move up, just pointing out an argument for it.

[MLitteer]

so at the end of the day pokerstars rewarded a bad call with the 2 outer??? i find that highly unusual.