Betting out early

[Machine_7]

Wanted some opinions on the following scenario. Early in 500+ person $10 MTT with $2 bounty, position big blind. 1500 in starting chips. Sitting on 1,700 chips. Play is rather loose and aggressive till now, with several all-ins in the fist 10 minutes. All-in hands have ranged from AA to JQ to mid pocket pair. Blinds are still 5 10 (first level) and levels are 10 minutes.

Dealt A 10

Under the gun folds, position 4 raises 3x blind to 30. 5 callers including small blind back to me! I call since I cannot fold for $20 more into $180 pot. I am not a fan of calling A 10 from early position but cannot fold here clearly.

Flop comes 10 7 2

Small blind checks.

Here are my thoughts... checking gives me no info if there is a bet. The only hand I am really concerned with was the original raiser, but his raise from early position of only 3x BB tells me he is more likely sitting on AK or AQ than pocket jacks or above. I cannot put the other 5 callers on any truly strong hand as they would have most likely re-raised if they had a premium hand (there is the possibility I am wrong). My only true fear is that somebody flopped a set at this point. I am hesitant to bet small since any 2 over cards are most likely calling or even re-raising, still giving me no info. To me this is either an over-bet or a check and fold... I hate to check though thinking I am at least 50/50 to have the best hand.

What would you do? Pot is roughly $200.

[deathcard71]

certainly the original raisers range could include JJ+. calling preflop seems perfectly standard. but after the flop we need to play with caution especially 6 handed. we could have the best hand here and a bet about 60% of the pot will tell us where we stand. no need to over bet the pot here, if they want to put chips in the pot with 2 overs then you should be happy to get the call.

if someone raises then i'm laying it down. no need to risk with TPTK this early. take the time to size up your opponents in the early rounds.

[Machine_7]

That is exactly what I did.

Folded all the way around to cutoff and button who both just call. Turn is a J.

My thoughts are they both hit a 10, or a straight draw. Now what?

[deathcard71]

That is exactly what I did.

Folded all the way around to cutoff and button who both just call. Turn is a J.

My thoughts are they both hit a 10, or a straight draw. Now what?

ugly card for us. we are OOP against 2 players. we really have to check/fold at this point, imo. it's possible they both have something like KT,QT,AT or T9 and a bet from them would blow us off the best hand but it's also just as easy for one of them to have a set, 89 or TJ.

check/fold

[iambl_e]

I would look at the big picture. Its the first level of play....500+ people. The amount of chips you gain in this pot are worth no where near the amount that you could lose. A 1/2 pot bet or 3/4 pot bet is around 10% of your stack. They could probably be used better in a situation later on.

[Machine_7]

You guys are both on the right track.

I bet again 3/4 of the pot figuring with no re-raises they are both either chasing or have kicker problems. I knew there was always a chance one of them flopped a set or even a boat.

The first guy called, the second guy raised, I folded. First guy re-raised the original raise, original raiser went all-in and second guy finally folded. Pretty bad bet on my part.

Funny thing is I folded a raise with AJ suited under the gun a few hands later, and would have flopped jack on flop for top pair top kicker with several people in the hand after me. Again there was a raise and a re-raise. Gotta fold those sub-premium hands UTG.

To your point, Phil Helmuth once folded a straight flush draw early in a WSOP tourney to an all-in bet after the flop to save his chips for later in the tourney when he had a more favorable advantage.

[frecklers]

I am looking at this and trying to think what I would do myself in the same situation and I came to the conclusion that I probably would just let it go pre flop.

The flop and subsequent action is exactly the reason why...i.e. It's not that I don't have value to call after so many PF callers, It is just the potential trouble that this hand could get me into with an EP raise and callers when I am OOP.

i.e. I flop an A (am I outkicked?) I flop TPTK (Is there a set or an overpair?)

If I decide to play the hand I am pretty much deciding that I am playing for flushes, str8's or any other huge flop hit like maybe trip 10's (Trip A's could potentially stack me!!) In this instance I am wondering if I do actually have any value top call as the reverse implieds are potentially awful for me.

Once I do call and bet out on the flop here the turn becomes J makes it a definite Check Fold. There are just Too many hands that will now beat me.

So to summarise...

Don't just consider the value your hand holds as a winner also consider the trouble it might get you into as a loser.

[travz21]

I would check/fold this flop a lot of the time. The other times I would just straightaway fold.

[phaul]

I check here 100%, then fold most of the time.